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July 18th, 2006

T-Mobile: 'No hotspot? Sorry, no refund either'

Posted by David Berlind @ 1:22 pm

Categories: General, IT Matters, Legal, Mobile, Personal Technology, Podcasts, Wired & Wireless

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Last Friday, the morning after Mashup Camp ended, I made it to my flight’s gate at the San Francisco airport with about 30 minutes to spare.  Knowing that T-Mobile operates an airport-wide hotspot, I figured that 30 minutes was just enough time to log into the hotspot, do a couple critical emails, and post my podcast interview of Eventful.com’s Chris Radcliff.  I took at seat in the airport lounge by the gate, popped open my notebook, enabled my WiFi adapter and saw that the signal strength for T-Mobile’s hotspot was "Excellent" (according to Windows).  It was clear from his tone that not reading the terms & conditions was an oversight on my part. Good I thought.  I fired up the browser and the first place it took me to was T-Mobile’s Web site where it showed me a bunch of options, one of which was perfect for me (the one where you pay $6.99 per hour).  But I couldn’t find a way to use it so I clicked through the day pass option for $9.99 instead.  But the minute I supplied all of my personal information including a confirmation of the payment by credit card, the WiFi signal mysteriously dropped to almost nil and I was unable to get a reliable connection.  It flittered in and out, but not for long enough to load a Web page or log on to the company network. 

I tried every trick I knew (and I have a lot of tricks having been down this path before with other hotspots) to no avail.  Suddenly, it was time to board.  I got on the plane and even tried to get at T-Mobile’s hotspot while I was in my seat (wouldn’t that be great?… to keep computing online until the flight attendants tell you to shut down?).  But that didn’t work and I gave in, resolving to call T-Mobile at the beginning of this week to get my money back.  After all, if I gave them my money but could not achieve a connection, surely their network management consoles must show that I used all of about 100 bytes and that they should give me my money back.  Today, I made that call and recorded the whole thing. I was very clear with the T-Mobile rep — a guy named Rudy — that I was recording the call.  Given the recent spate of some very public customer service snafus, I figured it was time to fall in-line and keep a podcast record of my support calls in case something goes awry.  You can download my recording of the entire call (it’s about 13 minutes long) or, if you’re already subscribed to ZDNet’s IT Matters series of podcasts, it should automatically show up on your PC and MP3 player. 

Although Rudy eventually relented with a consolation prize, he refused to issue me a refund saying on several occasions that, according to T-Mobile’s Terms and Conditions, I was not entitled to one.  It was clear from his tone that not reading the terms & conditions was an oversight on my behalf.  Go check it out.  Had I read that, by the time I got to the end, my plane would have been half way to Boston. I skimmed through it today and I’m not sure I see anywhere where it says something like "once you give us your money, it’s tough nuggies on you if our signal drops out and you get no work done." 

At approximately 1:40 into the call, Rudy tries to tell me that if signal goes out, that it doesn’t mean it’s T-Mobile’s fault and that if such an outage occurs that T-Mobile usually notifies everyone. By everyone, I’m assuming T-Mobile’s hotspot users.  However, I’m not sure how they do that if there’s a network outage.  Perhaps its through some form of wireless broadband telepathy. 

When I stopped Rudy to say that the network signal strength was very strong and that it wasn’t until I gave my credit card that the signal just dropped out on me, he told me how the "signal is there" (Rudy is apparently omnipresent) and then ran through a list of security solutions — high security settings, proxies, Norton Security, McAfee, and firewalls like ZoneAlarm and BlackICE — that would prevent the T-Mobile connection from working. This of course did not explain why the connection worked fine until after T-Mobile took my $9.99 for a day pass.  When I told him that none of those software solutions were my problem, at approximately 2:30 into the call, he says "David.. you’re not listening to me. I do this for a living every day.  Those are things that could be causing your problem. Now, if you didn’t call us on the day of service to help you and assist you with this problem, then the terms and conditions have been voided."  It was at that moment that any chances of me ever being a T-Mobile customer again were voided too.

Rudy explained that I should have called the 800 number immediately to try to resolve the problem.  Interesting suggestion. If only I could connect to the network to get the 800 number.  Or, am I supposed to commit that to memory? 

At 6:15 into the call, you can hear me asking for my money back and Rudy insisted on running through the terms and conditions, calling out the part that says "amounts paid for day passes are non-refundable."  Seems like a lopsided business term.  To bad I didn’t have my lawyer on hand to review the terms and warn me that if the network doesn’t work, the no refund clause still applies. Whatever happened to just taking care of the customer.  Does T-Mobile really need my ten bucks that badly?

At 8:13 into the call, Rudy tells me they have T-1’s all over the airport as if that has something to do with the strength of the wireless signal.  Thanks Rudy.  Next time, I’ll get a T1 adapter for my notebook.  Perhaps T-Mobile’s site has a map of all the T1 taps at the airport. 

At 8:22, he starts again into the explanations of how personal firewalls and other such security solutions could be responsible for loss of the signal and he reminds me of how he "deals with this everyday."  He’s obviously an expert.  As if any of this makes any difference.   I paid $10.  I got nothing for it.  Now give me my money back.

By the end of the call, I think I wore Rudy down.  He agreed to give me another one day pass that I can use at a later date.  It’s not what I wanted.  But maybe I’ll get to use it at a Starbucks or something.  Rudy explained that it’s an option he’s giving to me that "we normally don’t give to anyone."  Until now.  Hopefully.

Update: One day after this blog was published, a person by the name of Cornell Cunningham claiming to be a Senior Manager of Customer Care at T-Mobile contacted me by phone to issue an apology and comment on his thoughts about the call and his expectations of T-Mobile’s customer service personnel.  I asked him to send me his response in writing so that I could share it with ZDNet’s readers.  When and if that statement arrives (I had no way of verifying the caller’s identity), I will publish here on ZDNet. 

  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 209 Talkback(s)
RE: T-Mobile: 'No hotspot? Sorry, no refund either'
I bought the samsung gravity for $155.00 in March. I returned it in June as it was shutting off inetrmittently. They sent me a used phone, that within 1 month had the SAME PROBLEM. They then sent me A... (Read the rest)
Posted by: DONALD_EATON@... Posted on: 10/14/09 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
You have to wonder...  ju1ce | 07/18/06
That;'s easy ...  mwagner@... | 07/21/06
Argue that the service is not delivered  sinleeh@... | 07/19/06
The court of public opinion...  dberlind | 07/19/06
Good Luck  Zippy999 | 07/19/06
Too bad the agreement doesn't apply  voska | 07/20/06
Just thrilled you're saying something  arp_z | 07/19/06
The fact that you got a call from T-Mobile ...  mwagner@... | 07/21/06
Welcome to the Telco Monopoly  Steven J. Ackerman | 07/19/06
Same with the Cable companies...  nomorems | 07/20/06
chargeback = abra-ca-dabra  kckn4fun | 07/19/06
not a bad idea  alphawiz | 07/19/06
verifying the abra-ca-dabra  not_IT_John | 07/19/06
easy refund to get  ITSa341@... | 07/19/06
Everywhere you wanna be  improviz | 07/19/06
merchants have to pay a chargeback fee whether they are right or not  pitaro@... | 07/19/06
but won't hit t-mobile  lextori | 07/19/06
Re: but won't hit t-mobile  bka1959 | 07/20/06
I have experienced the same thing with T-Mobile at a Starbucks  CommSoft | 07/19/06
I was luckier  pablito@... | 07/21/06
T-Mobile Refund Warning  edmccloskey | 07/19/06
T Mobile  pmjm@... | 07/19/06
I *was* thinking of switching to T-Mobile  todd@... | 07/19/06
T-Mobile Phone Service Better  LA Songs | 07/19/06
Switching  djensen552 | 07/22/06
T-Mobile "No hotspot ..."  wainerg | 07/19/06
I have got refunds from 2 wifi operators  rc@... | 07/19/06
BUT...  disrdoyle | 07/19/06
Part of the problem...  improviz | 07/19/06
Chargebacks and email are the way to complain.  nomorems | 07/20/06
Portland OR (PDX) free WiFi  Ngallendou | 07/19/06
T-Mobile, they are only following big business rules.  StewV | 07/19/06
T-Mobile, Not Used, No Refund  PGelsman | 07/19/06
no problem with this  ken@... | 07/19/06
I have been using T-Mobile hotspots for 2 years and never had a problem  balsover | 07/19/06
"Not my problem?"  MerryOtter | 07/19/06
Come on...  OliverSeal | 07/19/06
Not just about bad customer service...  mscotch | 07/19/06
poor excuses  CobraA1 | 07/21/06
So?  mwagner@... | 07/21/06
I realize as human nature we focus on the negative...  OliverSeal | 07/19/06
Just following the Ferengi...  erc@... | 07/19/06
Near credit damages  dark33@... | 07/19/06
Read the book  jason.mailley | 07/19/06
Get Verizon BroadbandAccess  Mixotic | 07/19/06
Yeah, beacuse Verizon is SO much better than T-Mobile  disrdoyle | 07/19/06
BS!  HoneyBakedHam | 07/21/06
Love my T-Mobile.  nomorems | 07/20/06
T-Mobile: Pitbull with your CC  ArizumaBrett | 07/19/06
The one thing I've learned  ju1ce | 07/20/06
So to save $10 ...  Reged | 07/19/06
Ironically, had "Rudy" offered David ...  mwagner@... | 07/21/06
A few thoughts...  MerryOtter | 07/19/06
legality of recording calls  buffyslayer | 07/20/06
Correct.  nomorems | 07/20/06
I do not even know where to begin  Justin James | 07/19/06
Ridiculous  MerryOtter | 07/19/06
You just don't get it!  ken@... | 07/19/06
No, you do not understand "best effort"  Justin James | 07/19/06
*barf*  MerryOtter | 07/19/06
However...  Justin James | 07/19/06
how exactly do you call the help desk  voska | 07/20/06
LOL: how exactly do you call the help desk  bka1959 | 07/20/06
But that IS the crux of the problem..  Wolfie2K3 | 07/19/06
Unfortunately, not with a monopoly  Justin James | 07/19/06
You maid an important point  voska | 07/20/06
Justin have you ever had to deliver customer service?  GraysonBuzz | 08/05/06
And that, my friend, is how you lose customers.  CobraA1 | 07/21/06
And while I'm at it  CobraA1 | 07/21/06
How many times do I need to repeat this point?  Justin James | 07/21/06
I gota agree!  genen | 07/21/06
Good Business  llundgren@... | 07/22/06
I can't help wondering  ebrke | 07/21/06
Neither one, actually  Justin James | 07/21/06
Fault isn't the problem, one sided deals are.  CobraA1 | 07/21/06
What?!  davids@... | 07/21/06
re: What?!  CobraA1 | 07/21/06
No, a customer is often a former customer!  deleweye | 07/21/06
Here's where you begin  SteveTheWirePuller | 07/23/06
Thanks for the anti-referral...  blane@... | 07/19/06
The bar is set so low for Customer service you can tiptoe over it.  xstreamers | 07/19/06
File a Dispute with the Credit Card Company  jholcombe | 07/19/06
The Best Part  cshellem@... | 07/19/06
Dispute with CC company  Silent Observer | 07/19/06
Call the Credit Card Company  nrkmann@... | 07/19/06
Good Point  sinleeh@... | 07/19/06
good idea...  ranwalk@... | 07/19/06
Doesn't always work.  genen | 07/21/06
This is so Typical of T-Mobile  jonnybb1 | 07/19/06
Almost as bad as United Airlines!  nickull | 07/19/06
T-Mobile  bones2805 | 07/19/06
everyone I know uses verizon  qaz111111qaz111111 | 07/19/06
t-mobile  goose5843 | 07/19/06
bad attitude, not bad service  mpstewart@... | 07/19/06
a day pass is an arrogant assumption  buffyslayer | 07/20/06
At what point is wireless old tech?  voska | 07/20/06
Thanks for the Report  IceTheNet@... | 07/19/06
Don't you hate it?  mchast6755@... | 07/19/06
The customer is no longer right...  Wizairde | 07/19/06
Nearly every employee beyond a lowly salesperson has a vzw BroadbandAccess  GreatInca | 07/19/06
T-Mobile no hotspot  JPSJR | 07/19/06
Hammer away at poor customer service  rupaa62 | 07/19/06
Two points...  DOSmith | 07/19/06
If Rudy is in the U.S. I would say he's getting...  sykandtyed | 07/19/06
Sounds like my T-Mobile story  prof haury | 07/19/06
Consider that Rudy is being paid...  sykandtyed | 07/19/06
T-mobile  OHajek | 07/19/06
T-Moble or is it Trouble Mobile?  rcollis | 07/19/06
AT & T does it to  raymholt | 07/19/06
Maybe its time to just stick with GPRS  jatos.software@... | 07/21/06
Terms and Conditions,  chewymtaa | 07/19/06
Call your credit card company  jimmied43 | 07/19/06
Use your CC not your Debit Card  Violetw | 07/19/06
been on both sides of this cell phone  ksbubbs@... | 07/19/06
T-Mobile  kcast1 | 07/19/06
T-Mobile  kpr@... | 07/19/06
Mass Boycott  jatos.software@... | 07/21/06
I like that idea - let's do it  buffyslayer | 07/21/06
Do a Chargeback  fatrat | 07/19/06
I live in Croatia  zbrkic@... | 07/19/06
This not an isolated event  buffyslayer | 07/20/06
T-Mobile  zizka | 07/20/06
This is why I'm happy with my cable company.  yogeee | 07/20/06
Loved it!  kiddpeat | 07/20/06
T-Mobile: "No hotspot? Sorry, no refund either."  linds.lee | 07/20/06
Selling services that one cannot deliver is fraud, Pal!  yogeee | 07/20/06
Can you read?!  davids@... | 07/21/06
Can you think?!  TerryNT | 07/21/06
Drama with the muppets  linds.lee | 08/03/06
CSR Logic is mindless  lh80 | 08/03/06
Ya didn't read the article, at all; did you?  yogeee | 07/21/06
The out source company Must be Convergys  cellular1 | 07/20/06
T-Mobile - Not Global  joel@... | 07/20/06
Did you tell Rudy you were publishing the recorded conversation?  nomorems | 07/20/06
He doesn't have to  davids@... | 07/21/06
Customers Are Disposable  cybercjh | 07/21/06
big business ethics are dead - i dropped tmobile  eloftus@... | 07/21/06
Feelings Mutual  jatos.software@... | 07/21/06
T-Mobile Customer/Technical Service  jeff@... | 07/21/06
get real  WinnebagoBoy | 07/22/06
Absolutely Yes  freakmon | 07/21/06
I agree with John Maxwell  kscase@... | 07/21/06
I do not know where to begin  edward.reid | 07/21/06
how many times....  edward.reid | 07/21/06
T-Mobile not fair to Octogenarians, either.  pcug@... | 07/21/06
WHAT DO YOU EXPECT FROM CROOKS?  edward.reid | 07/21/06
Bad T-Mobile  jew123 | 07/21/06
Shame this wasn't in the UK  Scrat | 07/21/06
Re: Shame this wasn't in the UK  jatos.software@... | 07/21/06
T-Mobile  woody3249@... | 07/21/06
T-Mobile and Trustworthiness  manperez | 07/21/06
a better question  edomejn | 07/21/06
REFUND IT!!!!  jarnold-zd | 07/21/06
T-Mobile-SFO WiFi  Poobah | 07/21/06
T-Mobile vs. Boingo  jycccwjc@... | 07/21/06
Two things...  rogerjohnsen@... | 07/21/06
T- Mobile  big bad george | 07/21/06
Complain to Best Buy  Dr_Zinj | 07/21/06
Now THERE'S a productive response.  Akiddo | 07/22/06
Subsidiary?  tmobilerocks | 07/23/06
What an idiot!  d6564 | 07/21/06
Value lost for Value owed  Dr_Zinj | 07/21/06
T-Mobile  Dr_Zinj | 07/21/06
I can just about one up that!  Shelendrea | 07/21/06
I doubt whether it is...  jatos.software@... | 07/21/06
Wow! That service rep was really intelligent!  MisterJP | 07/21/06
Security Recommended (and laid on the shoulders of the customer)  sworley2@... | 07/24/06
T-Mobile  migtex2 | 07/21/06
T-Mobile: 'No hotspot? Sorry, no refund either'  ebhb2004@... | 07/21/06
What incentive would T-Mobile have...  flatliner | 07/22/06
wi-fi is not yet 100% stable  cho034442 | 07/21/06
Baffled  davids@... | 07/21/06
davids@ = Loverock  yogeee | 07/21/06
I see nothing to Cpmplain about.  jt524 | 07/22/06
DAY PASS = 24 hours continuous service  lh80 | 08/03/06
T-Mobile  armand@... | 07/22/06
They ONLY want NEW customers  LVKen7 | 07/22/06
What is YOUR email address  LVKen7 | 07/22/06
David, David, David, there you go again.  WinnebagoBoy | 07/22/06
Connectivity Hardware/Software issues  2cre8ive@... | 07/22/06
Right - XP's signal report is meaningless  Akiddo | 07/22/06
What the heck is a day pass for?  Suisunian | 07/22/06
connectivity vs signal strength  Akiddo | 07/22/06
Totally Unfair to T-Mobile  tmobilerocks | 07/23/06
RE: Unfair  sworley2@... | 07/24/06
comment:  DesertOutlaw | 07/24/06
If T-Mobile Rocks, why so many negative comments??  lh80 | 08/03/06
T-Mobile: No Hotspot? Sorry...  jminifie@... | 07/23/06
t-mobile snafu solution  pwg@... | 07/23/06
Astounded  eearle52 | 07/24/06
Good For You!  bbrumfield | 07/24/06
cell phone contracts  jim_d@... | 07/24/06
A little different  WinnebagoBoy | 07/25/06
T-Mobile Service  DesertOutlaw | 07/24/06
"Everywhere, rice is cooked"  erniemunoz | 07/24/06
Ever read the -back- of a telegram?  astro_z | 07/24/06
Where are the Terms and Conditions  sworley2@... | 07/24/06
Thanks David!  BrookStone5 | 07/25/06
T-Mobile Refund  perrine@... | 07/26/06
This is why......................  raymarc001 | 07/30/06
Another IDIOT CONSUMER!  phemish | 07/30/06
My 2.5 Cents  Tigiress | 07/31/06
Re: My 2.5 Cents  scott4u | 08/02/06
Good Rep Vs Bad Rep  Tigiress | 08/10/06
simple solution  charlie@... | 08/03/06
No hotspot? REVERSE THE CHARGE.  Quantum Rift | 08/04/06
It?s great that T-Mobile smiles well robbing you.  Frankog | 08/28/06
T-Mobile says "Pay Up"  cjespersen | 01/28/07
RE: T-Mobile: 'No hotspot? Sorry, no refund either'  DONALD_EATON@... | 10/14/09

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