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February 24th, 2008

Leaked Intel Nehalem performance projections over AMD Shanghai

Posted by George Ou @ 1:41 am

Categories: AMD, Hardware, Intel, News, Processors, Servers, Sun, Workstations

Tags: Performance, Shanghai, Advanced Micro Devices Inc., Intel Corp., Performance Management, Processors, Human Resources, Workforce Management, Semiconductors, Hardware

It appears that the rumors about Intel’s next major microprocessor “Nehalem” being a huge juggernaut may be true according to leaked documents from Sun Microsystems (removed Sunday night).  The slides appear to be inadvertently placed on Sun’s publicly accessible website and “jokerman” posted the link on Aceshardware (thanks to tip from ZDNet reader JumpingJack).  The slides looks like the real thing meant for Intel’s partners and they’re probably well known in the server industry.

Reliable sources have reported in the past that Intel’s Nehalem processor will have three channels of DDR3 memory per CPU versus two channels of DDR2 memory per AMD Barcelona or upcoming Shanghai processor.  That would mean that AMD’s massive memory bandwidth advantage will turn in to a large memory bandwidth.  So what does this mean for Intel Nehalem’s performance?  Take a look at the following charts I generated after carefully measuring the length of the performance bars on a pixel level.

Since Intel’s charts were normalized to an Intel E5160 dual-core processor on SPECint_rate_base2006 and SPECfp_rate_base2006, I had to start somewhere and make some guesses on the base performance.  I used Intel’s highest published SPEC CPU integer and floating point score of 60.8 and 45.1 for the E5160 processor as of 2/23/2007.  This is probably not the exact reference point that Intel used so the numbers might be off a little.

When I compared my extrapolated numbers to the published SPECint scores for all of the shipping products other than the E5160, I found that Integer performance was 2% to 7% too low and the average was 4%.  When I compared with published SPECfp scores other than the E5160, I found that my extrapolated numbers were all 4% too high for all models except the Opteron 2220 extrapolation which was 12% too high.  To adjust for this, I raised the SPECint estimates 4% and dropped the SPECfp estimates 5% and generated the following chart which is a closer match to the published scores.

I tend to believe that the second adjusted chart is more accurate.  We’ll most likely know by the end of this year what the actual scores are, but I doubt they will be more than 5% to 10% off from these estimated projections.

So how can Intel pull off such a massive performance boost over their current reigning champion “Harpertown” X5482 processor?  Consider the fact that Intel’s current generation 45nm Harpertown processors lead the benchmarks despite the memory bandwidth disadvantage because of a much faster execution engine and larger cache.  Then we factor in the fact that Intel will implement SMT (dual threads per CPU core), improve the already-fast execution engine of Harpertown, and feed it with three channels of DDR3 memory per CPU instead of the old shared front side bus.  AMD’s Shanghai on the other hand is essentially a die shrink, a cache size boost, and a clock speed boost.  Taking all these things in to consideration would easily explain how Intel could widen the lead so far.

I would also note that Intel’s leaked slides compare these processors in pairs where the Opteron 2220 DC (Dual Core) faces off with the Intel E5160 DC processor and the 2222 faces the X5365.  These two pairs represent a snapshot in time to when the products competed against each other.  The last two pairings on top may be generous to AMD since Barcelona processors aren’t shipping yet because of the TLB bug whereas Intel launched the X5482 in November 2007.  AMD’s Shanghai processor didn’t have first silicon until four months after Intel showed off their first silicon at spring IDF 2007 in September, but the difference is that Intel has showed the Nehalem running a real Operating System while AMD has not done the same for Shanghai.

Since it usually takes one year from first silicon to production parts, it’s a bit hard to believe that Shanghai will ship at the same time as Nehalem.  But even if it does ship at the same time as Nehalem, the competition from Intel looks very daunting if these estimates are anywhere close to being accurate.

George Ou is Technical Director of ZDNet. See his full profile and disclosure of his industry affiliations.

  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 95 Talkback(s)
RE: Leaked Intel Nehalem performance projections over AMD Shanghai
The two SPEC CPU base rates charts that accompany the article display FP and INT performance values. Can you please tell me the scale for the x-axis - what are the red and blue lines measuring? Thank you.... (Read the rest)
Posted by: cstallins Posted on: 10/19/08 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
Lies, lies and lies  zpdixon 42 | 02/24/08
Dell offers the X5482  John Mathers | 02/24/08
Uninformed FUDsters...  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
Uh oh, looks like you need to learn how to use the 'search' feature:  zpdixon 42 | 02/24/08
You forgot  SuperFly03 | 02/24/08
Hey, didn't you misrepresent things in the first post?  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
Ohhh, you don't know what subject you are talking about.  JumpingJack | 02/25/08
true, true, true  JumpingJack | 02/24/08
Another lie  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
AMD can forget the high ground  Prognosticator | 02/24/08
AMD is the top performer  wackoae | 02/24/08
AMD lost the crown in June 2006.,  bruce2003 | 02/24/08
Almost, not quite  fazalmajid | 02/24/08
What...are...you...smoking?  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
Yes/no in some cases  JumpingJack | 02/24/08
Message has been deleted.  SuperFly03 | 02/24/08
It takes a bigger moron ...  wackoae | 02/24/08
Please check your facts before speaking  SuperFly03 | 02/24/08
Superfly003  nickoli0_z | 02/25/08
Insults?  GIANTOYSTER | 02/25/08
Next time  SuperFly03 | 02/25/08
Ummm, no one cares about yesterday tech  No_Ax_to_Grind | 02/25/08
You lie  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
Oh please don't utter that name here  georgeou | 02/24/08
I apologize...  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
It's not Intels fault AMD can't produce a competitive CPU.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 02/25/08
Funny...  jasonp@... | 02/25/08
Useless rant  No_Ax_to_Grind | 02/25/08
IF these numbers are true, then yes...  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
The experts tend to agree with these projections  georgeou | 02/24/08
The context of the presentation is unclear...  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
Still, the projections are in line with industry expectations  georgeou | 02/24/08
It's a sad day...  jasonp@... | 02/25/08
Why? The projections have proven accurate.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 02/25/08
Intel CPUs are buggy too .....  wackoae | 02/24/08
Yes, all cpu's have errata  bruce2003 | 02/24/08
Misleading...  JumpingJack | 02/24/08
All CPU's are buggy  soonerproud | 02/25/08
The last comment  soonerproud | 02/25/08
Speaking of Errata  JumpingJack | 02/25/08
intel cpu's  vi0l3t1975@... | 02/24/08
Lawsuits happen all the time  georgeou | 02/24/08
Lawuits  nickoli0_z | 02/24/08
Not really. A patent is a "license to sue"  georgeou | 02/24/08
Yeah, big company big target  SuperFly03 | 02/24/08
It doesn't matter if you had 0 help or not  georgeou | 02/24/08
True  SuperFly03 | 02/25/08
The question should really be...  thetruthhurts | 02/24/08
Face it, AMDs 15 minutes of fame are over.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 02/25/08
We've got a real comedian among us...  jasonp@... | 02/25/08
Finally, some sense!  nickoli0_z | 02/25/08
Why do people like you...  thetruthhurts | 02/25/08
People like me...  nickoli0_z | 02/26/08
You're living in fantasy land...  thetruthhurts | 02/26/08
I think you're a bit confused  tyler755 | 02/26/08
Prices  tommcd64 | 02/26/08
Did AMD lower the prices of the lucrative Opteron at all?  thetruthhurts | 02/26/08
That's the point!  nickoli0_z | 02/26/08
Intel's other competitor(s)  nickoli0_z | 02/26/08
Kind of funny...  Robert Crocker | 02/26/08
I thought the same thing...  tyler755 | 02/26/08
Message has been deleted.  GIANTOYSTER | 02/25/08
Its what George Isnt Saying  tareeq.ali@... | 02/25/08
6 Core?  SuperFly03 | 02/25/08
Nehalem-EX 8-core is 45nm  georgeou | 02/25/08
Sorry Read The Leaked Slides  tareeq.ali@... | 02/26/08
Do you not understand what Dunnington is?  georgeou | 02/26/08
____  tareeq.ali@... | 02/26/08
You mean Scientia is claiming that, but he does not know what he is talking  georgeou | 04/04/08
45nm problems  wizardb@... | 02/26/08
Funny, they seem to be plenty available  georgeou | 02/26/08
Cool  SuperFly03 | 02/26/08
Did you say 6 cores?  thetruthhurts | 02/25/08
Not Really,  tareeq.ali@... | 02/26/08
Sigh. You really are digging a hole  georgeou | 02/26/08
So I have no idea of the real world...  thetruthhurts | 02/26/08
Nehalem-ES is native 4 core, not 6 core  georgeou | 02/25/08
Socket change?  SniperCT | 02/25/08
Yes, fundamentally different sockets  georgeou | 02/25/08
Thanks  SniperCT | 02/25/08
Note that we do not know if the desktop chips will have IMC or not  georgeou | 02/26/08
RE: Leaked Intel Nehalem performance projections over AMD Shanghai  atari8bit@... | 02/26/08
RE: Leaked Intel Nehalem performance projections over AMD Shanghai  atari8bit@... | 02/26/08
There isn't just one supplier for x86 CPUs if AMD would bo out of biz  thetruthhurts | 02/26/08
The other suppliers  nickoli0_z | 02/26/08
Buy the in-stat report and read for yourself  thetruthhurts | 02/27/08
I thought so  nickoli0_z | 02/27/08
Not true  thetruthhurts | 02/29/08
Can't argue with that logic...  nickoli0_z | 03/01/08
Yes, VIA, ARM Holdings, TI, ...  thetruthhurts | 03/02/08
Some more evidence  CFKane | 03/01/08
These were leaked - what don't you understand?  ORTechnology@... | 03/01/08
You're mistaken  CFKane | 03/02/08
You fail to understand that there is no comparison  georgeou | 04/04/08
RE: Leaked Intel Nehalem performance projections over AMD Shanghai  cstallins | 10/19/08

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