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May 31st, 2007

Why HD movie downloads are a big lie

Posted by George Ou @ 5:39 am

Categories: Consumer electronics, Fun Stuff, Infrastructure, Net Neutrality, Networking, VoIP

Tags: Internet, Movie, Video, DVD, There, George Ou

There’s a lot of buzz lately about the delivery of HD TV and Movie content over the Internet with shows like Lost being delivered by ABC.com and other video download services with XBox360 or iTunes.  I even have friends and colleagues telling me that BlueRay or HD-DVD won’t make it because HD will simply be delivered over the Internet.  But there’s one dirty little secret that people are forgetting or that they don’t understand, IT’S NOT HD they’re getting over the Internet.  Heck it’s not even NTSC 480i (720×480 60 fields interlaced) DVD quality when you really look at the amount of video data you’re getting!

Oh sure they might call it HD because it happens to be 1280×720 resolution which sounds awfully high, but you’re talking about an audio/video stream that’s 1.3 mbps (megabits per second) at best.  You can call it whatever you like and you can even claim it meets the minimum definition of HD because it’s 720p (1280×720) resolution but it ISN’T HD for the simple reason that the bit rate isn’t enough.  A regular 480i DVD is either 2, 5, or 8 mbps and most modern dual-layer 8 GB DVD releases are at least 5 mbps but more likely 8 mbps.  A typical DVD movie is approximately 6 GBs of data while a typical “HD” movie you download is only about 1.5 GBs of data.  Do you honestly believe you’re getting more image information in that 1.5 GB so-called HD movie you downloaded versus that 6 GB DVD movie?

[Update 3:35PM - I was a bit shocked to hear some people argue that a 1.3 mbps H.264 MPEG-4 based 720p 30-fps video stream can be better than an 8 mbps MPEG-2 480i 60-field DVD stream.  I'm going to explain something; it's impossible.  MPEG-4 can compress data in a more efficient manner such that it can have a 1.4x advantage over MPEG-2 in compression ratios while maintaining the same perceived quality.  However, there's absolutely no way that newer compression formats can overcome a 4 or 6 fold disadvantage in bitrate.  Compression - especially in the lossy world of video - is more of a subjective thing.  MPEG-2 video is already compressed fairly efficiently and you're really not going to squeeze out any more than a 2 fold improvement at best no matter how fancy the encoder is.  There can be marginal improvements in the field of compression but there are never free lunches.]

The fact that a DVD is only encoded in 480i video is unfortunate but it still has more video information and raw potential than a so-called HD movie download for the simple fact that it has 4 times more data.  A 480i video stream can be “up-scaled” to a 1080i or 1080p 1920×1080 display with glorious results and I guarantee you that it looks better than that so-called HD 720p movie you spent at least 3 hours downloading over the Internet while your family complains the Internet connection is really slow.

But truthfully speaking, the whole Blu-ray versus HD-DVD format war is silly because a regular dual-layer DVD can easily store 93 minutes of 12 mbps 1080i or 1080p H.264 or VC-1 encoded video with bare minimum HD quality that looks much better than normal MPEG-2 480i DVDs.  This format would have been extremely easy to produce and the players could have cost less than $100.  The only thing that HD-DVD gets you is that you can either store 3 hours of that same quality video or 100 minutes of good quality 20 mbps H.264 or VC-1 video.  Blu-ray players for some reason decided to forego the more advanced video codecs like H.264 or VC-1 and they’re using the old MPEG-2 encoding scheme which neutralized the capacity advantage of Blu-ray media.  [UPDATE 6/1/2007 - Newer Blu-ray titles have begun using H.264 so they've regained the capacity lead.]  But instead, we have a format war where no one is really winning since Sony decided to cede their market in the next generation console wars with the PS3 to salvage the BlueRay format. 

Another huge misconception is that people tend to confuse HD movie downloads over the Internet with HD IPTV.  While the acronym “IP” stands for “Internet Protocol”, people have the meanings reversed because Internet always involves IP but IP doesn’t always involve the Internet.  What I mean by that is that IP could strictly be a closed-network thing on a LAN (Local Area Network).

Note: It’s also a huge misconception that VoIP (Voice over IP) means Voice over the Internet because the vast majority of VoIP traffic happens on the LAN and gets switched over the PSTN (Public Switched Telephone Network).

IPTV requires 16 mbps per HD Channel and it would be IMPOSSIBLE for it to traverse the Internet in unicast traffic in the near tear or long term.  IPTV works on a very localized level within a carrier’s own network where everything travels on local fiber-optic multi-gigabit networks on a multicast (or cached) level out to the DSLAM and only from there does it unicast to the user over a mile of a pair of copper cables.  [Update 5:50 PM - Think of multicasting as a massive carpool where data is only transmitted once for everyone whereas unicast means the video bandwidth is multiplied by the number of users.  Even a 2 mbps unicast stream turns in to a 20,000 mbps stream with 10,000 users where as a multicast or locally cached 16 mbps stream for 100,000 users is still means 16 mbps of traffic over the backbone.]  That’s precisely why AT&T U-Verse wants to install miniature DSLAMs within a mile of their customers so they can support a 20 mbps DSL connection that can support a 16 mbps unicast HD IPTV stream over the last mile in addition to data access to the Internet.  Other than U-Verse, Verizon’s FiOS (Fiber to the premises or home) is the only other way that IPTV can be delivered to the home.  The Cable Internet companies don’t really care about IPTV because they deliver their digital television over a different frequency over the same coax cable and it’s a broadcast technology that sends out the same analog/digital signal to everyone’s house.

This is precisely why HD Movie downloads are a big fat lie being pitched to consumers because even the delivery of 1.3 mbps unicast traffic will bring most parts of the Internet down to its knees if enough people use the service.  The carriers are in a strategic position to be close enough to the customer that they can actually deliver true HD-quality IPTV with some level of video on demand and that scares the Googles of the world to death because there’s no way an Internet based 1.3 mbps make-believe HD video service can compete with true HD IPTV.  That’s precisely why Google lobbied so hard to defeat the Telecom bill last year which would have deregulated the Telcos so they could implement IPTV and Net Neutrality was merely a political “poison pill” to kill the Telecom bill.  More on this later …

George Ou is Technical Director of ZDNet. See his full profile and disclosure of his industry affiliations.

  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 185 Talkback(s)
RE: Why HD movie downloads are a big lie
http://www.gmboards.com has ways to watch HD movies online for free and for money. ... (Read the rest)
Posted by: popepollack Posted on: 03/19/09 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
Unfortunately, the requirement for claiming HD on ....  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
It's not the frame rate that's the issue  georgeou | 05/31/07
I disagree.  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
They're *effectively* reducing the frame rate of certain pixels  georgeou | 05/31/07
If you think that the 720P video on the net ....  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
I think you missed my point  georgeou | 06/01/07
huh?  shraven | 06/01/07
Normal for 720P is not 30 fps.  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Disagree all you want....  lpyrz@... | 06/01/07
You can appologise after you read the entire string.  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Yes, BUT...  unoriginal_sin | 05/31/07
Yup  Erik Engbrecht | 05/31/07
No buts about it!  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
Absolutely no way in hell when it's 4x more compressed.  georgeou | 05/31/07
Show me!  jgwinner | 06/01/07
very informative  Linux Geek | 05/31/07
Nothing wrong with HDTV, it's the download services that are suspect  georgeou | 05/31/07
With lovely built in time-bombs  cmjrees | 06/02/07
Good hardware + poor signal = poor picture  adr5@... | 06/01/07
In Euope it works  patibulo | 05/31/07
It is not a Europe versus US problem.  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
Hey my European friend. I don't care if you're from Mars; 1 mbps won't  georgeou | 05/31/07
who said 1 mbps?  patibulo | 06/01/07
I'm talking about DOWNLOADS  georgeou | 06/01/07
You are refering to your connection speed and ...  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Get on the same page  wirejockey | 05/31/07
Get a clue first  georgeou | 05/31/07
Oh yeah baby!  wirejockey | 05/31/07
You don't know what you're talking about  georgeou | 05/31/07
I am glad I am not the only one misunderstanding him  nucrash | 05/31/07
No matter what kind of network you have, you can't aford unicasting  georgeou | 05/31/07
have to reply here  patibulo | 06/01/07
Some forethought on blame  nucrash | 06/01/07
Blogger's post deleted?  cmjrees | 06/02/07
He's right, just off-topic  anilgupte | 06/01/07
No country allows true HD downloads unless it's chached at the edges  georgeou | 06/01/07
Yes and no  nucrash | 06/02/07
Gee, that's about what it costs in Europe, too.  ajole | 06/05/07
The real reason to push for HD is ...  Adrian Kingsley-HughesZDNet Moderator | 05/31/07
You're probably right on that  WiredGuy | 05/31/07
My ATT DSL for 1.5 is $19/month. You don't understand Germany.  georgeou | 05/31/07
DSL Service anomolies  wirejockey | 05/31/07
My teaser was $15. It locked down to $19 long term  georgeou | 05/31/07
As opposed to my boss who paid $50 for 100Mbps  nucrash | 05/31/07
You cannot get a 100Mbps connection ....  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Try Sweden.  Marty R. Milette | 06/01/07
Try it yourself!  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Try paying for other services in Japan  georgeou | 06/01/07
You're both wrong.  cmjrees | 06/02/07
and don't forget that over there they pay for so much bandwid and then when  SO.CAL Guy | 06/04/07
Also, try paying the phone bill in Germany sometimes  georgeou | 05/31/07
Economics  wirejockey | 05/31/07
Your rants don't make any sense  georgeou | 05/31/07
Aint no telco monopolies in Germany!  otaddy | 06/01/07
No so sure it's socialism  voska | 06/01/07
RE: Voska  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
ShadeTree is out to lunch. Big time  Cayble | 06/01/07
RE: Cayble  ShadeTree | 06/02/07
wirejockey what are you talking about (NT)  SO.CAL Guy | 06/04/07
Sorry, HD doesn't necessarily mean DRM  georgeou | 05/31/07
irrelevant  shraven | 06/01/07
The reason you don't have HD content on standard DVDs ...  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Good answer! Good answer!  Ole Man | 06/01/07
HD TV Rip  (``-_-´´) | 05/31/07
Nobody provides HD video  genericman | 05/31/07
They do provide ....  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
NO, they provide 16 mbps HD streams  georgeou | 05/31/07
Sensation! DVDs are big lie! They are no better then VHS! No, really!  khimru | 05/31/07
Digital?  frgough | 05/31/07
It is pretty amazing the amount of ...  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
That whooshing sound  frgough | 06/01/07
Look in the mirror if you want ...  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Your statement is the asinine one  NonZealot | 06/01/07
A plain DVD will kill a VHS tape  georgeou | 05/31/07
willfully obtuse?  shraven | 06/01/07
Close  frgough | 06/01/07
What is patently false ...  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Enlighten me  frgough | 06/04/07
frgough is like most other intellectuals  NonZealot | 06/04/07
What a pitiful logic  nucrash | 06/02/07
Strawmen, strawmen everywhere  frgough | 06/04/07
Wrong!  ShadeTree | 05/31/07
You do not know what you are talking about. PERIOD.  georgeou | 05/31/07
is something wrong with your eyes VHS sucks (NT)  SO.CAL Guy | 06/04/07
Best never to say "never"  j.m.galvin | 05/31/07
I think you completely missed the point  georgeou | 05/31/07
You obviously have no idea what you're talking about  rhavyn | 05/31/07
MI2 is fairly new isn't it?  georgeou | 05/31/07
BTW, the blog is about how 1 mbps "HD" can't be HD  georgeou | 05/31/07
I Love It!  seal@... | 06/01/07
What kills me ...  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
You obviously have no idea you're a retard  donnyduncan@... | 06/01/07
No grammar nazis - unless you're correct.  electrodyne | 06/01/07
For what it's worth...  John Sawyer | 06/01/07
Did you read my message?  rhavyn | 06/01/07
Blu(e)-ray  turgenev | 06/22/07
Speaking of bandwidth  Robert Crocker | 05/31/07
All of this ain't gonna matter.  kraterz | 05/31/07
Fortunately your ....  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Forests and trees  TonyMcS | 05/31/07
No you still missed the point  georgeou | 05/31/07
Misconceptions?  mixja | 06/01/07
I didn't say they only supported MPEG-2,  georgeou | 06/01/07
can you blame them?  adr5@... | 06/01/07
You might want top add yourself to that category.  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
CD Audio is 44.1 KHz 16-bit uncompressed  georgeou | 06/01/07
You are wrong here George!  ShadeTree | 06/02/07
I didn't mean it didn't loose original analog data  georgeou | 06/02/07
digital v analog v compression  wademontana | 06/04/07
Compression gives you the biggest bang for the buck  georgeou | 06/04/07
Good article  shraven | 06/01/07
Thanks, but it still doesn't look better than SD scaled up  georgeou | 06/01/07
This sentence needs a correction  ross@... | 06/01/07
Ah, good catch.  georgeou | 06/01/07
Good job  FSUGrad1999 | 06/01/07
George is right as are a few of you..but...  lpyrz@... | 06/01/07
They can try to shove two 8 mbps streams  georgeou | 06/01/07
Really missing the boat...  michael.bloom@... | 06/01/07
Yes you did!  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
I get it.  RealTimer | 06/01/07
In fairness, my title says "download" and I did mean most download services  georgeou | 06/01/07
If you are refering to downloads ...  ShadeTree | 06/02/07
Very much agreed  georgeou | 06/02/07
Ouch, they'd have to Akamai the hell out of it  georgeou | 06/01/07
George reveals "Dirty Little Secret"  SteveMak | 06/01/07
One observation.  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Blu-ray doing well because of PS3  georgeou | 06/01/07
Blu-ray outselling HD-DVD?  SteveMak | 06/03/07
When you count PS3, Blu-ray recently surpassed HD-DVD  georgeou | 06/03/07
Where can I validate your statements?  SteveMak | 06/04/07
Clear this up for me...  elbrando | 06/01/07
To a point.  ShadeTree | 06/01/07
Calculaion is incorrect  ericradomsky@... | 06/01/07
There is no reason for greater then 8 bit color ...  ShadeTree | 06/02/07
LCD  ericradomsky@... | 01/22/08
If Cox Cable cached those downloads for you  georgeou | 06/01/07
You loose "HD" when you compress it!  brittonv | 06/01/07
DirectTV's over compression is nothing in comparison  georgeou | 06/01/07
Mb/s  cmjrees | 06/02/07
Nothing wrong with mbps, that's accepted abrieviation  georgeou | 06/02/07
Spoiled, spoiled, spoiled.  The_Curmudgeon | 06/01/07
Even worse in other areas  jgwinner | 06/01/07
I did a Wireless LAN deployment in Mexico 2 years ago  georgeou | 06/01/07
What an utter waste  ChMacQueen@... | 06/01/07
"massivly [sic] BS" ?  RealTimer | 06/01/07
U Caveman Me Man, Where the Future is Now! wink  i2fun@... | 06/01/07
Which is irrelevant  rhavyn | 06/01/07
That was true for all of 2006 was it not?  georgeou | 06/01/07
What? Was the last time YOU checked 2004?  i2fun@... | 06/01/07
Last time I checked was a couple months ago  georgeou | 06/01/07
Yes it could have stood on it's own! Agreed!  i2fun@... | 06/01/07
It wasn't a misnomer last year  georgeou | 06/01/07
@George Ou - BluRay Does Support VC-1, MPG-4! wink  i2fun@... | 06/01/07
Calm down, the blog isn't centered on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD  georgeou | 06/01/07
Blu-ray spec vs Blu-ray Reality  SteveMak | 06/05/07
Great Article  croberts | 06/02/07
The concept of "inches" is often misunderstood  georgeou | 06/03/07
Blu-ray outselling HD-DVD?  SteveMak | 06/03/07
When you include PS3, PS3 recently surpassed HD-DVD  georgeou | 06/03/07
What's Great and What's Good Enough!  THEE WOLF | 06/03/07
It's not even good enough to lick the boots of SD DVD  georgeou | 06/04/07
HD over IP  jb123 | 06/04/07
That's an experiment that doesn't apply to the current Internet nor does it  georgeou | 06/04/07
I am NOT interested in web-bourn media.  Big Scoddie | 06/04/07
This blog needs some work  pl2004@... | 06/05/07
Your knowlege needs some work  georgeou | 06/05/07
Why HD movie downloads are a big lie  BP71957 | 06/05/07
I am pro HD and I use free HD over the air  georgeou | 06/05/07
This whole thing is silly  ajole | 06/05/07
Re: Quality doesn't matter. Sadly  neverXmiss | 08/20/07
High-bandwidth Digital Video Content considered HD only?  Grayson Peddie | 06/05/07
Only a fool believes 1.3 mbps H.264 can be better than 8 mbps MPEG-2  georgeou | 06/05/07
Exactly.  neverXmiss | 08/20/07
HD lists on ListAfterList.com  prattosu@... | 06/07/07
Numbers Smumbers. Get a life George.  Narg | 06/14/07
oh be quiet  neverXmiss | 08/20/07
file transfer question  mark.premo@... | 10/22/07
illegal downloads can be true HD  tim7891@... | 01/08/08
8 Gig versions  Starfire77 | 05/01/08
RE: Why HD movie downloads are a big lie  FishnChips | 09/12/08
nice site  madhandhileepan | 12/04/08
nice site  madhandhileepan | 12/04/08
RE: Why HD movie downloads are a big lie  JDlaw27 | 12/14/08
Peer to peer networks  mvdven | 12/28/08
RE: Why HD movie downloads are a big lie  popepollack | 03/19/09

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