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October 25th, 2007

Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?

Posted by John Carroll @ 9:37 am

Categories: Antitrust, Microsoft

Tags: Sanction, Web, Antitrust, Microsoft Corp., U.S. Department Of Justice, Standards, Corporate Law, Quality, Linux, Channel Management

The sanctions imposed on Microsoft as part of its settlement with the DOJ and the States (and subsequently ratified by Judge Kollar-Kotelly) are set to expire in November. This has led to a difference of opinion between America’s Department of Justice, the federal agency tasked with enforcing American laws at the federal level, and the state Attorneys-General. The DOJ doesn’t believe that the necessary standards have been met to justify extension. The states (or at least 10 of them) believe further oversight is warranted.

The states use a “results” standard to support ongoing oversight, arguing that the 90% market share is proof that the sanctions have not worked (echoes of similar logic used in past statements by the EC, though Ms. Kroes did later backtrack from such statements). They also feel that the continuing dominance of IE gives them leverage to block web standards and thus prevent the development of competitors to their core businesses.

To put it mildly, I think their frame of reference is still stuck in the mid-1990s. Who DOESN’T test their web applications under Firefox these days, and what is the AJAX phenomenon if not an attempt to replicate the interactivity of desktop applications using standards-based web technology?

I could go on, but the closing paragraph of an article on Ars Technica explained the situation so much better.

With Firefox market share rapidly climbing and major hardware vendors like Dell selling computers preloaded with Linux, it seems like present market conditions no longer provide Microsoft with the leverage it needs to impede innovation. The California group has already admitted that the efficacy of the sanctions is somewhat questionable. At this point, it seems like radically innovative business models—like those used by open-source software and Web 2.0 companies—are doing more to equalize competition. If the function of antitrust is to promote competition and not merely to punish companies for market dominance, then the position of the New York and California Groups seems overzealous. The decision of the US not to ask for extensions seems both reasonable and unsurprising.

Microsoft is unlikely to want to step into the antitrust tar pit anytime soon, so I somehow doubt that they are, say, going to penalize Dell suddenly for shipping Linux products. Microsoft would quickly attract unwanted DOJ scrutiny were they to do that, not to mention scrutiny from any number of antitrust hotspots around the world (Southern California isn’t the only place with barely controlled brushfires).

So what do you think? Can Microsoft still use its market power to do mischief, or has the land shifted so much in the last decade that they must truly scramble to maintain their position?

Is Microsoft still dangerous?

  • Yes: Microsoft requires ongoing close oversight to protect the marketplace. (57%)
  • Sort Of: Though Microsoft can't kill competition, it is unlikely to be displaced by natural market forces. (24%)
  • No: Microsoft must scramble fast if it wants to stay on top. (19%)

Total Votes: 1,543

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John CarrollJohn Carroll has delivered his opinion on ZDNet since the last millennium. Since May 2008, he is no longer a Microsoft employee. He is currently working at a unified messaging-related startup. See his full profile and disclosure of his industry affiliations.

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  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 155 Talkback(s)
Not apples to apples
AT&T was ripped apart because it was the only game in town. People have other options when it comes to OS's. If you are such a stickler for having Windows Preinstalled on a retail computer and you d... (Read the rest)
Posted by: Khyron Posted on: 12/17/07 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
Love those polls  Yagotta B. Kidding | 10/25/07
Check out "silly poll" post below!! Its a great post!  TG2 | 10/26/07
The question is...  John L. Ries | 10/25/07
And...  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/25/07
Which company?  Yagotta B. Kidding | 10/25/07
And in the mean time...  John L. Ries | 10/25/07
until i see...  Khyron | 12/17/07
And risk the destruction of the company...  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/25/07
Third time's the charm?  Robert Crocker | 10/25/07
Re: Third time's the charm?  none none | 10/25/07
Egg on our face...  Information_z | 11/04/07
Not apples to apples  Khyron | 12/17/07
Politicians can be bought  John L. Ries | 10/25/07
Which DOJ?  Yagotta B. Kidding | 10/25/07
Re: And risk the destruction of the company...  none none | 10/25/07
And...  aussieblnd@... | 10/25/07
Pull the Pin  X41 | 10/31/07
The provisions of the anti-trust settlement...  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
Are those provisions permanent?  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
Yes.  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
Active enforcement can wane  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
Is a wounded snake still dangerous?  Ole Man | 10/25/07
Ah  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/25/07
Snake analogies always work  Ole Man | 10/25/07
And lots of predators.  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
Veeeeeeeery unusual!  Ole Man | 10/26/07
Destroy all predators?  itpro_z | 10/28/07
Or not.  Anton Philidor | 10/29/07
Lions and Tigers and Bears  Ole Man | 10/29/07
Homo sapiens escaped predators...  Anton Philidor | 10/29/07
To Anton  itpro_z | 10/30/07
Homo sapiens escaped predators...  Ole Man | 10/30/07
 xuniL_z | 10/31/07
Go back to sleep, Zuny  Ole Man | 10/31/07
Ballmer/Smith's mindset hasn't changed!  kd5auq | 10/25/07
All because  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/25/07
because .....  aussieblnd@... | 10/25/07
IBM's giveaway...  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
I'll get back to you  Yagotta B. Kidding | 10/25/07
Who should the DOJ be protecting with anti-trust?  NonZealot | 10/25/07
Two consumers would be protected  Robert Crocker | 10/25/07
Your second point raises an interesting question  NonZealot | 10/25/07
No, all activities are viewed in the light of the offender  Robert Crocker | 10/26/07
You forget...  epcraig | 10/26/07
Perhaps.  slopoke | 10/26/07
Correction  Yagotta B. Kidding | 10/25/07
That answers my question then  NonZealot | 10/25/07
The DoJ needs to project Microsoft.  Resuna | 10/26/07
What happens to HP?  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
The proof is in the Vista  Robert Crocker | 10/25/07
Vista "Downgrading"  David Wilson | 10/26/07
No rebellion  itpro_z | 10/28/07
"Microsoft has for many years allowed us"  Ole Man | 10/29/07
I wouldn't ask the DoJ to do anything  Richard Flude | 10/25/07
MS up to the same tricks  John L. Ries | 10/25/07
Right, I never expected them to change  Richard Flude | 10/25/07
The Justice System Works Fine  windozefreak | 10/26/07
Where did that one come from?  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
Break-up unlikely.  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
You're probably right, but...  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
If it's a conduct remedy...  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
You missed  Richard Flude | 10/26/07
Microsoft is not like IBM  kedens | 10/25/07
IBM Clouds the Microscope?  orcmid | 10/26/07
not Dell... but they would and have with others  Meez | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  DistinctDispatches@... | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  Randalllind | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  DB_z | 10/26/07
Silly Poll  orcmid | 10/26/07
Wow - very well written!  TG2 | 10/26/07
"recidivism"  On Site PC | 10/26/07
Could you suggest another term?  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
Good show old chap!  thx-1138_@... | 10/31/07
I Disagree  Cardhu | 11/11/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  jimkennedy@... | 10/26/07
There needs to be a fourth choice.  mwagner@... | 10/26/07
Have You Stopped Beating Your Wife?  lmenningen | 10/26/07
choices - the lack there of  TG2 | 10/26/07
Poor analogy  On Site PC | 10/26/07
Poor analogy ?  On Site PC | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  wanderson | 10/26/07
So I'm going to be shipping my next computer in from France?  mad tabby | 10/26/07
Microsoft is the MOST Dangerous Company in America  rgeiken@... | 10/26/07
you need to re-read what you've typed and clarify your thoughts  TG2 | 10/26/07
Huh??  mad tabby | 10/26/07
Microsoft is bloated with arrogance.  3dtodd | 10/26/07
POLL BROKEN  Resuna | 10/26/07
So...  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  robertcape@... | 10/26/07
Huh?  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/26/07
Still Dangerous? Yes, but...  Hobed | 10/26/07
Don't blame Gates but...  ufg@... | 10/26/07
But the courts  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/26/07
You always frame the question...  wmlundine | 10/26/07
Of course I'm dangerous  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/26/07
re: Of course I'm dangerous  deaf_e_kate | 10/30/07
No according to your dad...  wmlundine | 10/30/07
Expect Microsoft to be MORE predatory  RexBallard | 10/26/07
M$ was and still is dangerous...  Old Timer 8080 | 10/26/07
So...  John CarrollZDNet Moderator | 10/26/07
TOO MANY PROBLEMS FOR THE WEALTH LEVEL  BALTHOR | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  arthurhaglund@... | 10/26/07
Microsoft has already attained its position.  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
I'd rate you...  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
Observations  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
Yes to a captive market - OEM' s etc.  On Site PC | 10/26/07
You can still buy a computer with XP Pro.  Anton Philidor | 10/26/07
why not stay within the law? so why don't they (EU)  stevey_d | 10/29/07
The EU cases were apparently a surprise.  Anton Philidor | 10/29/07
Big Money is Big Evil  bcroner | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  perversion2003@... | 10/26/07
A lot of hard work doing what?  John L. Ries | 10/26/07
Seriously -- What sanctions?  mad tabby | 10/26/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  Sinbad713 | 10/27/07
The 1951 Consent Decree with AT&T Should have been the Model  lcarliner@... | 10/27/07
Microsoft is more dangerous than ever  TechExec2 | 10/27/07
I have to agree with you there  roaming | 10/28/07
A few points  itpro_z | 10/28/07
Nice reasoning. But, you are wrong.  TechExec2 | 10/29/07
Nice reasoning. But, you are wrong. (corrected, ignore the other)  TechExec2 | 10/29/07
I disagree  itpro_z | 10/29/07
My reply  TechExec2 | 10/29/07
And again  itpro_z | 10/29/07
Parting shot...  TechExec2 | 10/30/07
To TechExec  itpro_z | 10/30/07
itpro_z: Yes...  TechExec2 | 10/30/07
"Concerning WGA.......form of copy protection"  Ole Man | 10/29/07
The problem with your reasoning...  ju1ce | 10/30/07
The problem with your reasoning...  itpro_z | 10/30/07
Oh, And Steve Ballmer Would Naturally Choose  Cardhu | 11/11/07
Concerning WGA  itpro_z | 10/30/07
Pacifist, thou name art itpro_z  Ole Man | 10/30/07
The main difference...  itpro_z | 10/31/07
I do not trust the Government  Ole Man | 10/31/07
PS:  Ole Man | 10/31/07
To: Ole Man  itpro_z | 10/31/07
WGA Counterpoint  Cardhu | 11/11/07
don't belive M$ figures!  Linux Geek | 10/29/07
The financial numbers  TechExec2 | 10/29/07
Dangerous?...Yes like the largest dinosaur!  linux for me | 10/28/07
Ah  roaming | 10/28/07
MS 's ways..!  Techno_Drive | 10/28/07
Perplexed by focus of the story . . .  riotsquirrl | 10/29/07
Dangerous to whom?  No_Ax_to_Grind | 10/29/07
Windows is the monopoly product.  Anton Philidor | 10/29/07
Thank the Lord  Ole Man | 10/29/07
Dangerous to Joe Average User -- Absolutely  Cardhu | 11/11/07
Still dangerous??? Of course!  Userama | 10/29/07
Wha Wha  jpellone | 11/14/07
Remember Geoworks  lcarliner@... | 11/14/07
How terrible! Affordable HW and SW  rhwells@... | 12/13/07
The more important question is...  bricar2 | 12/13/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  grail@... | 12/13/07
Of course  eda@... | 12/13/07
RE: Poll: Is Microsoft still dangerous?  Absolutely | 12/16/07

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