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August 20th, 2009

Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal

Posted by Mary Jo Foley @ 10:09 am

Categories: Channel, Corporate strategy, Internet Explorer, Legal, OEMs, Resellers, System builders, Vista, Windows 7, Windows XP, Windows client

Tags: Microsoft Internet Explorer, Microsoft Corp., Web Browser, Mozilla Corp., Proposal, EC, Web Browsers, Microsoft Windows, Internet, Operating Systems

At the end of July, Microsoft officials shared publicly the company’s browser-ballot proposal made to the European Commission antitrust regulators. On August 17, execs with Microsoft rival Mozilla weighed in with new and more detailed objections to Microsoft’s proposal.

Microsoft’s browser-ballot proposal is part of the ongoing settlement talks between the EC and Microsoft over the antitrust suit filed by Opera Software against Microsoft over the bundling of Internet Explorer (IE) with Windows. The EC has yet to issue a final ruling in the case, but has been discussing with Microsoft, PC makers and other software vendors different options designed to level the browser playing field.

One option, originally repudiated but later advocated, by Microsoft is the inclusion of a browser-ballot screen in Windows that will make it clear to users that they have a choice of browsers and don’t need to rely on IE just because it comes bundled with Windows. Microsoft is proposing that the ballot-screen be delivered to current and future XP, Vista and Windows 7 users over Windows Update,

Until this week, Microsoft’s browser competitors seemed,for the most part, cautiously optimistic about Microsoft’s ballot-screen proposal.

But on August 17, Mitchell Baker, Chair of the Mozilla Foundation made it clear she had a number of objections to Microsoft’s proposal.

“(E)ven if everything in the currently proposed settlement is implemented in the most positive way — IE will still have a unique and uniquely privileged position on Windows installations,” Baker blogged.

Even if the screen were implemented as Microsoft has proposed, IE still gets prominent placement in the Windows user interface, she charged. The Taskbar in Windows 7 gives IE prominent placement, she said, with IE shortcuts remaining part of the user experience unless the user turns off IE. And “choosing another browser as a ‘default’ does NOT mean that the other browser takes the place of IE,” Baker claimed.

Baker also objected to the way Microsoft is proposing that users get their browser bits, both in the way the proposal suggests users download competing bits, as well as the way Microsoft is proposing using Windows Update. She isn’t too keen on Microsoft’s hard-coding of links to IE into “potentially all Microsoft products other than Office 2007.”

Mozilla Corp. Vice President and Chief Counsel Harvey Anderson shared similar objections to the Microsoft proposal, which he itemized in an August 18 blog post. Anderson also highlighted the ordering of the alternative browsers on the ballot, as well as the Microsoft proposal’s lack of  user education as areas where more information and specifics are needed.

Microsoft officials had nothing to say about Mozilla’s new objections.

“The European Commission is reviewing the proposals we submitted July 24, and it’s important that public feedback be part of that process,” said Microsoft spokesperson Kevin Kutz. “While we may not align on every specific point, we welcome Mozilla’s input and find their perspectives constructive.  We look forward to the next steps in the Commission’s review.”

One former Softie, Charles Fitzgerald, a Vice President of Product Management with Decho, had a more pointed response, which he blogged on August 20: “Attention Mozilla: less lobbying, more bug fixing.”

What’s your take? Do you think Mozilla’s execs have any valid objections?

Mary Jo FoleyMary Jo has covered the tech industry for more than 20 years. Don't miss a single post. Subscribe via Email or RSS. You can also follow Mary Jo on Twitter.

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  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 114 Talkback(s)
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal
Kojax is a mobile development platform, according to my sources, that will allow Microsoft- ? and third-party-developed costumes applets run in an Ajax-like way, using a combination of Visual Studio tools and JavaScript, on Java-based mobile phones.... (Read the rest)
Posted by: Jackie150 Posted on: 10/09/09 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
Mozilla should focus on its product!  mailbox01 | 08/20/09
You do know Mozilla has nothing to do ...  mrlinux | 08/20/09
His point  djmik | 08/20/09
Completely different, and Chrome has a lot to do with it  davidr69 | 09/01/09
The reason is  rparker009 | 09/02/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  Anirask | 08/20/09
I don't see Microsoft shooting their feet.  nucrash | 08/21/09
Wow, it sure gets complicated!!  NonZealot | 08/20/09
Just out of interest...  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
Consistency would be nice  NonZealot | 08/20/09
I agree that consistency would be nice..  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
I think I answered that  NonZealot | 08/20/09
Thanks  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
It's not illegal to be a monopoly...  olePigeon | 08/20/09
Ole pidgeon  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
I don't feel bad for the Zune's status  Wintel BSOD | 08/21/09
You are mistaken  Isocrates | 08/21/09
To set you clear, monopoly does not mean 'The guy with the better products"  No More Microsoft Software Ever! | 08/20/09
Why does every body get the law wrong  Djblois | 08/20/09
It's not the bundling, it's the integration. [nt]  olePigeon | 08/20/09
What integration? I can install IE just fine in Windows 7  MissingMatter | 08/20/09
They are all the same  Djblois | 08/20/09
I am sick and Tired of the EU with immense anger  bolfakl | 08/21/09
Amen!  nordyj2001@... | 09/02/09
There is no Apple monopoly  jorjitop | 08/20/09
and no microsoft monopoly  otaddy | 08/20/09
Agreed - when I install Linux Firefox is there should I be ticked about ...  ItsTheBottomLine | 08/21/09
What do you care  Wintel BSOD | 08/21/09
iPhone Monopoly?  nucrash | 08/21/09
You don't have to buy an iPod  grail@... | 09/01/09
iPhone monopoly!  goff256 | 09/02/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  Loverock Davidson | 08/20/09
So does this mean...  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
The whole point is that Microsoft isn't removing IE. [nt]  olePigeon | 08/20/09
That would not be fair!  Djblois | 08/21/09
On Linux  goff256 | 09/04/09
Um... read agin  kaninelupus | 08/22/09
The whole Baker blog post makes no sense  ihatevi | 08/20/09
I especially don't understand point 6  MissingMatter | 08/20/09
We're running into a weird new mindset in the name of anti-monopoly  TheWerewolf | 08/20/09
You make too much sense  mikefarinha | 08/20/09
Somebody give this man a cigar!  npiaseck | 08/20/09
Wow another Intelligent Man on this site!  Djblois | 08/21/09
Well said  Colfax_Mac | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  Ammalgam | 08/20/09
Yup, this whole thing makes MS look very good  NonZealot | 08/20/09
I agree that  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
Agree - this makes Mozilla look like a bunch of babies - nt  ItsTheBottomLine | 08/21/09
LOL... grin  Wintel BSOD | 08/21/09
Neither are acting like adults...  Viva la crank dodo | 08/20/09
It's not the bundling, it's the integration. [nt]  olePigeon | 08/20/09
this is part of the experience many users want  cymru999 | 09/01/09
How bout this?  Shelendrea | 08/20/09
browser-ballot proposal doesn't go far enough  Salman Pak | 08/20/09
Hehe, why stop at calculators?  NonZealot | 08/20/09
Indeed!  Salman Pak | 08/20/09
There you go discriminating again!  mgp3 | 08/20/09
It would help if you even knew what you were talking about. [nt]  olePigeon | 08/20/09
You can delete the calculator, you can't delete Internet Explorer. [nt]  olePigeon | 08/20/09
In W7 you can (nt)  MissingMatter | 08/20/09
Uh...what do you mean???  beldar33@... | 08/20/09
It doesn't uninstall, it just removes the desktop icon. [nt]  olePigeon | 08/20/09
Educate yourself!  kaninelupus | 08/22/09
Well then, don't use it...  codedude | 09/01/09
Um yeah you can  kaninelupus | 08/22/09
why do I need to.....  cymru999 | 09/01/09
So?  nordyj2001@... | 09/02/09
LOL  nordyj2001@... | 09/02/09
The ballot doesn't matter because MS still links apps to IE  KyleDDM | 08/20/09
Sound like you have problems with your PC  djmik | 08/20/09
Microsoft Works, Windows Update, Microsoft Money...  olePigeon | 08/20/09
Then you can't uninstall Safari from OS X  NonZealot | 08/20/09
That's funny I have firefox and anything that links  ItsTheBottomLine | 08/21/09
Lucky you  jacarter3 | 08/21/09
Or try using Secunia  Wintel BSOD | 08/21/09
Simple solution...  LeeC | 09/01/09
Not simple  Wintel BSOD | 09/05/09
you got that wrong  cymru999 | 09/01/09
Novice!  andrej770 | 08/20/09
You're right  beoz | 08/20/09
You must know some seriously clueless people.  LeeC | 09/01/09
right why dont you push that......  cymru999 | 09/01/09
woops  KyleDDM | 08/20/09
Out of line.  Bryan Price | 08/20/09
I told you!  markbn | 08/20/09
Where is the pacifier?  Nsaf | 08/20/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  beoz | 08/20/09
Forget Windows, get Linux  apexwm | 08/21/09
Linux just does not cut it  rogerbro@... | 08/21/09
You didn't try hard enough  Wintel BSOD | 08/21/09
yes like its going to run the latest games...  cymru999 | 09/01/09
Good for you  Wintel BSOD | 09/05/09
Become a SysAdmin  davidr69 | 09/01/09
Be careful or  People | 08/21/09
Ha ha  davidmeridian | 08/21/09
Ha Ha  People | 08/21/09
Thanks M$ for the web design hell  valvestate@... | 08/21/09
Microsoft should be able to do whatever THEY WANT with THEIR OS!  kqcomputers | 08/21/09
Are you as big a fool as you sound?  Isocrates | 08/21/09
Talk about hyperkill  kaninelupus | 08/22/09
agreed  goff256 | 09/03/09
It was Neelie Kroes having the courage...  Henk de Boer | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  sgtm8@... | 09/01/09
The average user isn't aware  davidr69 | 09/01/09
But  sgtm8@... | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  Bugiman_underbed@... | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  leopards | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  LeeC | 09/01/09
You can't have it both ways ...  mwagner@... | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  cymru999 | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  Bill1016 | 09/01/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  fastpa | 09/02/09
Dumb dumb dumb  nordyj2001@... | 09/02/09
RE: Mozilla execs raise objections to Microsoft's browser-ballot proposal  Jackie150 | 10/09/09

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