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March 15th, 2007

Should Microsoft start paying for vulnerabilities?

Posted by Ryan Naraine @ 11:49 am

Categories: Apple, Black Hat, Browsers, Data theft, Exploit code, Hackers, Microsoft, Patch Watch, Pen testing, Punditocracy, Responsible disclosure, Vulnerability research, Zero-day attacks

Tags: Software, Vulnerability, Microsoft Corp., Hacker, Ryan Naraine

Hackers are starting to agitate for Microsoft to start paying for information on security flaws found in its software products.

The issue surfaced this week after the MSRC (Microsoft Security Response Team) posted a message on the sla.ckers.org message board, calling on third-party researchers to submit vulnerability information directly to Redmond before going public. Microsoft's Sla.ckers forum post

The invitation — which extended to bugs found in all of Microsoft online web properties such as *.microsoft.com, *.msn.com and *.live.com — is part of Microsoft's insistence on the concept of "responsible disclosure," where researchers give advance notice to affected vendors but, for the first time, the response from hackers suggest it's time for Microsoft to offering cash rewards for flaw information.

Immediately after Microsoft's Sla.ckers.org post, "digi7al64" replied with this:

[I] propose MS implement a reward system where you agree to pay cash for vulnerabilities found within your domains. The benefit of this I suggest would be flood of vulnerabilities reported the first few months which would tapper off to only 1 or 2 intermittently as new systems come online.

The cost of this type of project would be relatively low and if you placed a sliding scale on amount paid (based on the vun) I'm sure you could get away with it for less then 20-50k all told… which in the big scheme of things is a drop in ocean for MS.

Information on software defects are considered extremely valuable — vendors use it to improve the quality of products — but the existing "responsible disclosure" system gives the information for free to software vendors, even those with deep pockets.

The existence of third-party brokers like Verisign's iDefense VCP and 3Com Tippingpoint's ZDI has validated the market for software flaws and given white hat hackers a place to make money for their work but there is a growing feeling that the big vendors — especially Microsoft — should set up a bug-bounty program that tangibly rewards external researchers.

Microsoft's official policy is that responsible disclosure works just fine and the credit given to bug finders in security bulletins is more than enough but a burgeoning black market and the spike in zero-day attacks provide proof that the status quo needs fixing.

Jeremiah Grossman, founder and chief technology officer of WhiteHat Security, weighs in:

Now think about this… if given the option, how many of the organizations that have been outted would have gladly paid a voluntary reward for the disclosure and saved themselves the negative press? Probably a fair number would have participated. Also of course, if they choose not to participate, there’s nothing lost and things remain the same. Though if an organization budgeted say $10,000, which could help to eliminate a ton of XSS and SQL Injection issues. And at some point vulnerabilities would get much hard to find and system security would improve. Obviously a lot of details would have to be worked out to counteract any extortion or blackmail schemes. I’m not quite ready to begin recommending this approach, but I think it’s worth continuing a dialog over.

Chris Eng, director of security services at Veracode, urges caution, especially when it comes to auditing Web applications:

These posters either don’t realize or are conveniently ignoring the fact that it is illegal to stage unauthorized attacks against these websites to begin with. There are a lot of shady underground economies, but that doesn’t necessarily make them legal or ethical.

Ryan NaraineRyan Naraine is a journalist and security evangelist at Kaspersky Lab. He manages Threatpost.com, a security news portal. Here is Ryan's full profile and disclosure of his industry affiliations.


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  • Talkback
  • Most Recent of 98 Talkback(s)
No where sabotage is involved.
If someone designs a device that squirts oil into all of your breaks when your car is pointed at a significant downward angle, the manufacturer of the vehicle is not responsible. How different is this... (Read the rest)
Posted by: bobsterz69 Posted on: 03/29/07 You are currently: a Guest | | Terms of Use
Yes they should if there is damage done...  Linux User 147560 | 03/15/07
Interesting  Taz_z | 03/15/07
Depends on tthe payment model  mds_z | 03/16/07
I agree  janesman2007 | 03/16/07
Not the way it's sold.  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/15/07
Then Government Should Change The EULA  itanalyst | 03/15/07
So who pays when I purchase it from Red Hat  GuidingLight | 03/15/07
Nice Try  Update victim | 03/16/07
What does free have to do with it?  John Zern | 03/16/07
Oops, a little too much cut and paste?  John Zern | 03/16/07
But if your read down below  xuniL_z | 03/19/07
One of software's biggest myths  xuniL_z | 03/16/07
Daniel Wallace already proved that wrong.  NetArch. | 03/16/07
Forgot one thing:  NetArch. | 03/16/07
It's statements like yours  xuniL_z | 03/17/07
Um Google is in compliance with the GPL  Linux User 147560 | 03/17/07
Ok, then they are walking a fine line, no?  xuniL_z | 03/18/07
Also, it's not "guys like me"  xuniL_z | 03/17/07
That's easy  Linux User 147560 | 03/17/07
Just a few more questions.  xuniL_z | 03/18/07
no gov  janesman2007 | 03/16/07
Ninth Circuit history  Update victim | 03/16/07
Not what they're talking about  rapson | 03/15/07
Not you again! devil  Linux User 1 | 03/15/07
Well if that isn't  Shelendrea | 03/16/07
who is that?  xuniL_z | 03/16/07
yes it is  Shelendrea | 03/16/07
As long as it's applied evenly  xuniL_z | 03/16/07
Newsworthiness.  MageOfChaos | 03/16/07
The terms and license agreement says NO  intrepi@... | 03/19/07
Microsoft should not be allowed to lie.!  as901 | 03/20/07
Should Microsoft Pay?  rbooth1000@... | 03/22/07
I should be paid for  No_Ax_to_Grind | 03/15/07
what if it is economic for criminals to buy security holes from hackers  stevey_d | 03/15/07
Message has been deleted.  itanalyst | 03/15/07
On behalf of "Fat Women" everyewhere  Shelendrea | 03/16/07
Mysogenist or just hate women?  B.O.F.H. | 03/16/07
Keep the blows above the belt.  MageOfChaos | 03/16/07
He Only Has To Look In A Mirror  itanalyst | 03/16/07
Bidding war?  Anton Philidor | 03/15/07
Great idea who's time is...  Cardinal_Bill | 03/15/07
why isn't everyone marching in the streets?  stevey_d | 03/15/07
There are bigger reasons to march in the streets  intrepi@... | 03/19/07
C'mere script kiddies.  Anton Philidor | 03/16/07
Not a bad idea  itpro_z | 03/15/07
No  whisperycat | 03/15/07
Makes good business sense  TripleII | 03/15/07
Yeah right.  woozoo | 03/15/07
Why Not?  DemonX | 03/19/07
Pay me or I publicly disclose?  wolf_z | 03/16/07
might make microsoft to think twice  dl0711 | 03/16/07
Works for me -- but...  archangel999 | 03/16/07
Why are you singling out just one  xuniL_z | 03/18/07
Their license terms and agreement nips this in the bud  intrepi@... | 03/19/07
Right Idea  Ole Man | 03/21/07
It would be like charging an old lady after  xuniL_z | 03/16/07
Old Lady is $100 Billionaire  ITRockstar | 03/19/07
SOS  xuniL_z | 03/19/07
"Reno brought shame to the Justice department"  Ole Man | 03/27/07
Especially for LOST Productivity  philobal@... | 03/16/07
Does that apply to bugs in your code that your company paid you to write?  archangel999 | 03/16/07
Hundreds of hours saved, maybe?  John Zern | 03/16/07
In the Godfather and the Sopranos they call it something different  MacGeek2121 | 03/16/07
Ryan, Ryan, Ryan. Give me a break!!!  Narg | 03/16/07
1st Third of every phonebook?  toxic psychotic avenger | 03/16/07
black market vulnerability auctions  bcroner | 03/16/07
That's just stupid  archangel999 | 03/16/07
Yeah, it is stupid that people has to pay for MS's flaws  ITRockstar | 03/19/07
Presumably you would apply that to whatever you create too??  archangel999 | 03/16/07
That's more like it!  Ethical_Loner | 03/16/07
Holy Techies Batman!  Ethical_Loner | 03/16/07
This article sucks!!! (NT)  joethemacfan | 03/16/07
Sucks what ? Silly statement - want to enhance ?  intrepi@... | 03/19/07
my just microsoft ?  Aussie_Troll | 03/16/07
my just microsoft ?  lmenningen | 03/18/07
Let's Play "What If"  Ole Man | 03/21/07
monetize  shraven | 03/16/07
Huh???  rhamman@... | 03/16/07
MS is paying already  Omch'Ar | 03/16/07
Side note:  MageOfChaos | 03/16/07
Multiply the 1000 cuts by 10,000,000 and maybe  intrepi@... | 03/19/07
Pay for vulnerabilities?  wheels4u | 03/16/07
Pay for vulnerabilities?  wheels4u | 03/16/07
It's their responsibility anyway  bennyhur | 03/16/07
Hell Yeah  Secret52@... | 03/16/07
They should pay for any and all user supplied information  tracy anne | 03/16/07
Should Microsoft start paying for vulnerabilities?  writer2065 | 03/16/07
NO... WINDOWS USERS SHOULD PAY FOR OWN IGNORANCE !!  artifax@... | 03/17/07
OneCare proves Microsoft wants customers to pay for it...  HypnoToad72 | 03/17/07
OneCare proves Microsoft wants customers to pay for it...  HypnoToad72 | 03/17/07
OneCare proves Microsoft wants customers to pay for it...  HypnoToad72 | 03/17/07
OneCare proves Microsoft wants customers to pay for it...  HypnoToad72 | 03/17/07
Don't buy Microsoft OSes brand new off the shelf  ssybesma | 03/17/07
Vista Home Ultimate???  ceh4702 | 03/28/07
I dont see a problem with this.  Been_Done_Before | 03/17/07
Speaking of vulnerabilities, MS just released SP2 for server 2k3  Been_Done_Before | 03/17/07
ME Buy Back  ceh4702 | 03/28/07
No where sabotage is involved.  bobsterz69 | 03/29/07

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